Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder

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Primal Fear
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Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder

Post by Primal Fear »

I have this problem since the last two (maybe but unlikely 3) Nightly Builds and now it happened again.

Pressing the middle mouse button via Xpadder causes a quiet beeping noise like the one that comes (or better came, since it isn't possible with my rather cheap keyboard anymore) when you press to many key on the keyboard at the same time.
The real middle mouse button doesn't cause this and restarting Xpadder helps sometimes.

Primal Fear
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Primal Fear »

I figured out the reason for this. It's a conflict between the software of my mouse (MSI StarMouse GS-503) and Xpadder.
This beep only occurs if I have a profile for this mouse software loaded. I didn't had this problem until now, since I either use joystick and mouse (which means real middle mouse button) or the gamepad (which means that I don't load a profile for my mouse). Now I had a game where I needed to hold the middle mouse button all the time, so I used Xpadders toggle function for that.

I have tested it also with the latest Stable Release and it also has this problem.

Jonathan
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Jonathan »

This beep is probably the PC Speaker. Computers had these before soundcards and they still exist today - while building a desktop PC you sometimes get these beeps if your memory is incorrectly installed. The old keyboard beep was the same thing. The beep usually means error - in the case of a keyboard is was saying "buffer full - you're pressing too many keys at once". Maybe this beep is saying a similar thing but for the mouse buttons?

Try disabling the mouse software so you have just a basic mouse driver. Now hold the middle mouse button while you simulate it via Xpadder. Does it beep also?

Primal Fear
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Primal Fear »

Jonathan wrote:This beep is probably the PC Speaker.
Yes, it is. :shifty: I know the difference. ;)
Jonathan wrote:Try disabling the mouse software so you have just a basic mouse driver. Now hold the middle mouse button while you simulate it via Xpadder. Does it beep also?
Like I already said, the real mouse button doesn't cause this. I have tried this anyways, and the beep doesn't occur too while pressing the real middle mouse button together with an emulated by Xpadder.
This mouse software is for loading profiles for the special buttons of this mouse. And when I have a profile loaded, pressing the middle mouse button via Xpadder causes this beep. I don't even have to press any of these special mouse keys on the mouse.

If I also look on how thoughtful and user friendly this mouse software is, I guess that the problem is simply that this mouse software was bungled together in record time. Too bad about this great idea with these three 4-way buttons.
The problem is most likely only on the side of the mouse software, so I would say this thread should be moved.

Jonathan
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Jonathan »

Few more ideas:

- see if the mouse software enters any info into the keyboard test when you press the button
- does this occur with the other mouse buttons?
- is the middle mouse button the scroll wheel or the button above it?
- if it is the scroll wheel, does the scroll function still work in a browser page as it usually does?

Image

It could be that the mouse software is saying to the driver "I'm in charge of the mouse buttons" and Xpadder attempts to simulate it and it complains

Primal Fear
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Primal Fear »

Jonathan wrote:- see if the mouse software enters any info into the keyboard test when you press the button
No, it detects no input when I press the middle mouse button while having a profile in the mouse software loaded.
Jonathan wrote:- does this occur with the other mouse buttons?
I have already tried this, no.
Jonathan wrote:- is the middle mouse button the scroll wheel or the button above it?
- if it is the scroll wheel, does the scroll function still work in a browser page as it usually does?
The middle mouse button is as usual the mouse wheel.
If you mean the AutoScroll function (white circle with the black point and the black arrows in it). Yes that works.
If click some where to get rid of this, the scrolling via mouse wheel also still works while holding the middle mouse button via Xpadder.

While holding the middle mouse button via Xpadder or with the real mouse, the only thing that accepts mouse input anymore is the window that is currently in focus. Basic Windows elements doesn't detect mouse input anymore. The Task Bar doesn't appear anymore after moving the mouse cursor over it it and I cannot click on anything (what causes that start menu doesn't open, that I cannot open programs out of the tray, that I cannot change the window in focus with the mouse,...). The only window that accepts mouse input the window that is currently in focus.
Does this occur with Windows7 or Vista too (I guess you don't use XP anymore)? Maybe this is a "feature" of Windows. And this feature stands in conflict with the mouse software.

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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Jonathan »

The focus issue is standard for all versions of Windows. The control that you initially click on takes ownership of the mouse actions and no other control responds until you release the mouse button.
Primal Fear wrote: Pressing the middle mouse button via Xpadder causes a quiet beeping noise like the one that comes (or better came, since it isn't possible with my rather cheap keyboard anymore) when you press to many key on the keyboard at the same time.
The real middle mouse button doesn't cause this and restarting Xpadder helps sometimes.
Does the problem only occur when holding the mouse button - does a quick click cause the beep also?

So everything works as usual but simulating a mouse wheel click while the software is loaded causes a beep - there is no functional problem?

Primal Fear
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Primal Fear »

Only only beep while activating the toggle, a short click also causes the beep.
Interesting is using the turbo, the system internal speaker will stay behind the button presses when the turbo is too fast and so it still beeps when the mouse button wont be pressed anymore.
Jonathan wrote:The focus issue is standard for all versions of Windows. The control that you initially click on takes ownership of the mouse actions and no other control responds until you release the mouse button.
That makes sense, at least for the left and right mouse button.

Jonathan
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Jonathan »

While it is probably a problem with the software I'm still wondering whether this beep may be a useful clue to something Xpadder should take care of in the future.
Primal Fear wrote:This mouse software is for loading profiles for the special buttons of this mouse
What functions can be loaded onto which buttons?
Is it possible to select the middle mouse click to occur for a wheel click?

Maybe the software is simulating a middle mouse click itself and this bumps heads with Xpadder's simulation.

Can you assign a letter key to the wheel click and see if also emulating that key in Xpadder causes a beep?

Primal Fear
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Primal Fear »

Jonathan wrote:What functions can be loaded onto which buttons?
Is it possible to select the middle mouse click to occur for a wheel click?
I can assign keyboard key presses and standard combinations (like CTRL+...) to the each 4 directions of the three silver special buttons (they work like a coolly hat on a joystick). So I cannot change the function of any normal mouse button.
Jonathan wrote:Maybe the software is simulating a middle mouse click itself and this bumps heads with Xpadder's simulation.
Can you assign a letter key to the wheel click and see if also emulating that key in Xpadder causes a beep?
If I assign the same key to a special mouse button and a controller button via Xpadder I get no beep, not even when I press both at the same time.
I have downloaded Xpadder 5.4, because of it's possibility to not detect emulated keyboard input in the keyboard test. The input from this mouse software will be detected when "Allow Emulated Keys" is disabled. So it creates the input via a special driver. I guess the input for the normal mouse function should work over a driver at all, since the mouse software has no functions for them.


I have just ordered a Saitek Cyborg V1, since I have finally enough of this software. Maybe a joystick can also replace a mouse. At least two joysticks will look ultimately geeky. :lol:

I will still have this mouse (I won't throw it out of the window or anything like that :shifty:), if you still would like to have something tested.

SGTCableDog
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by SGTCableDog »

Could it be an old school resource conflict? If I remember correctly the PC speaker is controlled by the system timer via Programmed Input/Output ports. Could the physical mouse (or other hardware device) used the same I/O ports and pushed the PC speaker to use the same ports that Xpadder uses. This assumes Xpadder emulates keyboard and mouse on a more physical layer than Windows APIs. On my laptop the system timer uses IRQ 0 and I/O ports 40-43 and 50-53 for resources.

This idea is taken from a faint memory from stuff I used to mess with 20 years ago. It may have been all a dream. :noob:

Jonathan
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Re: Quiet beep noise when pressing middle mouse key via Xpadder (Nightly Build)

Post by Jonathan »

If the software cannot alter the mouse wheel click function then I cannot see why there is a beep? Cable could be right - beeps don't happen often anymore and when they do it's because of a low-level problem. Xpadder uses the standard Windows API exactly as documented and does nothing more low-level than that.

While we haven't solved the issue I think that Xpadder is not directly the problem. I'll move this topic to the Mouse help forum - if we get a comment in the future about a beep then we can continue researching!

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